all best,
Rebecca Miller

While there are many valid points raised within Renny’s query, I think the real value is in the tangential direction some of the replies took, particularly — is it really such a concern which artists leave and which artists stay in the Bay Area, much less conducting a study of why? Like the death of painting (and now photography), I agree that this is a fairly pointless and exhausted issue.

Artists by nature are a migrating species — it’s one of the things we do best; go someplace to challenge something new. I’m sure artists leave these other cities at a rate somewhere equal to that of the Bay Area, but perhaps for different reasons. It could just be that we notice it more here because we’re smaller in number and as one result more community set then the Big 4. Personally, I prefer that. To compare the Bay Area art scene to NYC, LA, etc., is really quite silly. We are not them as much as they are not us. And as soon as you compare yourself to another you’re in danger of taking the inferior stance. I think this is what a number of responses identified as ‘insecurity,’ and perhaps feeds the notion of the Bay Area’s “lack of [aggressive] criticality.” We should all stop holding any place in higher esteem then our own studio/gallery/museums, money flow or not. First “we must cultivate our garden” Voltaire.

Yes, we certainly need Bay Area collectors to stop buying the work of Bay Area artists from NY galleries when those artists are also being represented in BA galleries. This has been going on for far too many years and it’s just frigg’n crazy. The BA art community (and the cities tax tills) is getting its thin pockets picked. It’s certainly in the artist’s interest, but not our position/job to confront local collectors on the broader effects of this practice. Is a piece of art produced in the Bay Area more valuable if it is purchased from a gallery outside the Bay Area? I believe today there’s a sad answer to that, and this is a start to what needs to be addressed. If it’s a prestige thing, this certainly needs to be redirected asap. Risking naiveté (once again), but by supporting their own local art market the collectors themselves would have greater power (inside track advantage) and a direct effect on increasing the value of that market on a national and international level. So by default wouldn’t these collectors also be increasing the value of their own collection of BA art? Maybe I’m wrong, but I think this was something the dear and departed Ms Phyllis Wattis did quite successfully for many years.

It seems more BA collectors need to trust and be educated by their BA galleries in the building of their collection. I apologize for feeling I need to apologize for my east coast bluntness (I moved to the Bay Area in ’95 from Hoboken, NJ), but taking full advantage of having no gallery rep or affiliation to insult, someone’s got to step up and have the cojones and/or be clever enough to get more of the local big money to respect and support the local art scene without filtering 50% of their investments through other cities. There I said it. Then of course they can foster a trickle down effect towards the under recognized BA artists w/ zero professional charisma (just a self serving opinion, and thank you Marcella for inadvertently suggesting it). This all goes up the ladder to the museum level. I know there are a few galleries who see this as an opportunity and are making it one of their missions, but perhaps the Bay Area needs a larger or alternative force. I have no clue what that force would be.

As for some Bay Area artists, I think this insecurity is also somewhat reflected in the “I just do what I do” attitude (which is a real shame considering the incredible amount of talent here) and what seems to be a cyclical regurgitation of a “Bay Area style.” Now before I get the 16 to 28 year old BA art community tagging my home, what I’m actually saying is that this type of work doesn’t need to stop, it needs to be pushed forward. In my humble through critical view, the residual impressions of the 1990’s Mission School is no longer unique or “cutting edge” (i hate that term almost as much as “emerging”). I guess I’m pointing a finger here, but it had its day. It’s done. Note to academia: generally recognized as BA art, it doesn’t generate all that much interest outside a select Bay Area community anymore and needs a “rigorous and critical” injection if it’s going to be anything that hasn’t been done in the very recent past. And I will echo Anthony’s comment, that I believed echoed ZRS’s comment, we should not “confuse criticality with negativity.” Take this work to its next level already. It’s very possible that this is happening and I just don’t see it yet. But from the good view of this man’s porch, there is very little there today that’s new or challenging. There I said that too. And now I should shut up before I create division where I seek to sponsor unity.

Sorry for being so late to the discussion. Thank you Renny for bringing petrol to this spark and I’ll end my thoughts here. But in a shameless plug for early visibility and community support: …inspired in part by this very thread… keep your antennas up for the Bay Area Untied Football Club (BAU FC).

first match Sunday June 6, 2010 in LA, opponent, Grupo Bijari, Sao Paolo, Brazil

We shall proudly unite w/ our Bay Area expat-artists who have chosen to migrate south
for whatever reasons, to band as one, under a single flag, and face our imminent slaughter at the cleats of our Brazilian collaborators!

…yes, shameless, but motivated and secure in the shadow of certain obliteration!

GO BAU FC!

But I am a bit confused by the stance of insecurity that seems to permeate the SF art community. I’ve felt it in museum programming, artists, dealers and the local art schools. Why do we compare ourselves with NYC or LA? Have you been to those places? Because they’re not thinking about us at all. They are too busy trying to survive in their own surroundings. Unless you self select as someone who gets to NY and thinks oh-my-god-this-place-is-for-me, you’ll probably need to spend a good chunk of mental energy convincing yourself that it makes logical sense to live like that, and that there is simply no alternative. Ideal for making art? Hard to imagine, but I guess it could provide the necessary angst if you need some.

I love NY, and I think LA is weird in a sometimes entertaining way, but I’m leaving the Bay Area only when it’s a field of rubble. Or, more likely, if we just can’t afford it anymore. Needless to say, we will not be moving back to NY. It would prevent me from doing what I want to do.

But in terms of the scene here, I really don’t care if people stay here or leave. I guess it’s like a relationship, if they don’t want to be in it, they probably weren’t right for the place. I’d rather engage with the people who think it’s worth sticking around, and there are plenty of amazing people who do.

Whatever happened to Paris? I thought part of being an artist was that we stopped worrying about this stuff and made our own reality. Do you think Dave Eggers could do what he’s done if he was based in Brooklyn? I don’t. Ferlinghetti? Craig Newmark? Harvey Milk? Steve Jobs? Diebenkorn? Alice Waters? Pixar? There’s an unflinching innovation across that list that I am proud to wallow in.

Thanks for raising the topic, Renny. Joseph mentioned this thread was unfolding and I finally remembered to have a look.

PS. Get back here, Lee Walton. You know you want it.

Renny, I don’t think (or at least hope!) that your questions emerge from a place of insecurity about the SF art scene (as suggested by Mr. Strange). I prefer to frame them as an arts leader reflecting on the changes of the arts as an ecological system, and trying to ascertain why a specific change (people leaving versus staying) has occurred — and if there is a pattern that can be traced around this specific event. It appears the question is posed in the first place because the departure of artists is seen as having negative repercussions on the ecosystem, rather than merely seeing it as part of the flux of things, i.e. “X artist left, but Y artist arrived!”

I left San Francisco 4 years ago. While in San Francisco I had a wonderful community of productive and critically engaged artists that consistently met to have dialog about each other’s work. I had shows in the SF bay area and beyond. On the balance, was able to make my work. I adjunct taught throughout the bay area. Yet, despite these important elements coming together, I ultimately left San Francisco for a tenure-track job that would give me immediate and long-term financial stability, which to me translated into having more headspace to make my work.

If I could’ve gotten fulltime academic work in SF would I have stayed? Very likely. However on the intangible side of things, after living in one place for 16 years I also wanted a change. This desire for change had nothing to do with perceptions about the SF art scene. If this were the case, I would have moved to one of the big 4. Instead I moved to the desert! The desire for change was about needing new and different experiences in life– this I find important for my productivity and continued growth as an artist.

For the sake of the data-gathering, here are a handful of other former bay area artists that also left primarily because they wanted/needed fulltime academic jobs (of this I am almost 100% certain):
Michael Trigilio
Robin Ward
Mary Tsiongas
Geof Oppenheimer
Amy Hicks
Ellen Babcock

If the SF arts community believes that the departure of artists, in general, has an adverse effect, hopefully data gathered could be utilized to attempt to change the dynamics of the surrounding climate in order to improve the likelihood that artists will stay rather than leave. For this to happen there needs to be some kind of consensus about priorities. I.e., in order for artists to stay in SF do they need jobs? What kind of jobs? How much money do they need to earn? Does it have to be a teaching job? What percentage would prefer it if the money instead came from art sales? If the financial conditions were satisfied would the majority artists stay? Then how to best go about creating the right kind of jobs/expanding the base of local collectors/ increasing sales… Or instead, is the top priority for artists to have a more diverse community (online, published, local networks) of critical dialog and an improved external perception about the SF art scene? If SF were externally regarded on par with the LA, NY, Berlin, etc. artworld, would it be sufficient motivation for artists stay rather than leave? Would the majority do so even if they couldn’t really afford to financially? Then how to best go about changing external perceptions…